diff --git a/src/backends.jl b/src/backends.jl
index e7ca5ec3..f1077905 100644
--- a/src/backends.jl
+++ b/src/backends.jl
@@ -44,21 +44,19 @@ include("backends/web.jl")
 
 # ---------------------------------------------------------
 
-
-plot(pkg::AbstractBackend; kw...)                       = error("plot($pkg; kw...) is not implemented")
-plot!(pkg::AbstractBackend, plt::Plot; kw...)           = error("plot!($pkg, plt; kw...) is not implemented")
-_update_plot(pkg::AbstractBackend, plt::Plot, d::KW)  = error("_update_plot($pkg, plt, d) is not implemented")
-
 # don't do anything as a default
 _create_backend_figure(plt::Plot) = nothing
+_prepare_plot_object(plt::Plot) = nothing
 _initialize_subplot(plt::Plot, sp::Subplot) = nothing
-_update_min_padding!(sp::Subplot) = nothing
-_update_position!(sp::Subplot) = nothing
-_before_update(plt::Plot) = nothing
+
 _series_added(plt::Plot, series::Series) = nothing
-_update_plot(plt::Plot, d::KW) = nothing
 _series_updated(plt::Plot, series::Series) = nothing
 
+_before_layout_calcs(plt::Plot) = nothing
+_update_min_padding!(sp::Subplot) = nothing
+
+_update_plot_object(plt::Plot) = nothing
+
 # ---------------------------------------------------------
 
 
diff --git a/src/backends/bokeh.jl b/src/backends/bokeh.jl
index 5d3c46db..5317016b 100644
--- a/src/backends/bokeh.jl
+++ b/src/backends/bokeh.jl
@@ -170,7 +170,7 @@ end
 # ----------------------------------------------------------------
 
 # TODO: override this to update plot items (title, xlabel, etc) after creation
-function _update_plot(plt::Plot{BokehBackend}, d::KW)
+function _update_plot_object(plt::Plot{BokehBackend}, d::KW)
 end
 
 # ----------------------------------------------------------------
diff --git a/src/backends/gadfly.jl b/src/backends/gadfly.jl
index 359a724c..28e00d72 100644
--- a/src/backends/gadfly.jl
+++ b/src/backends/gadfly.jl
@@ -595,7 +595,7 @@ end
 
 
 
-function _update_plot(plt::Plot{GadflyBackend}, d::KW)
+function _update_plot_object(plt::Plot{GadflyBackend}, d::KW)
     updateGadflyGuides(plt, d)
     updateGadflyPlotTheme(plt, d)
 end
diff --git a/src/backends/glvisualize.jl b/src/backends/glvisualize.jl
index 965201d0..0f5752d7 100644
--- a/src/backends/glvisualize.jl
+++ b/src/backends/glvisualize.jl
@@ -95,80 +95,42 @@ function _create_backend_figure(plt::Plot{GLVisualizeBackend})
 end
 
 
-# function _series_added(::GLVisualizeBackend, plt::Plot, d::KW)
+# ----------------------------------------------------------------
+
 function _series_added(plt::Plot{GLVisualizeBackend}, series::Series)
   # TODO: add one series to the underlying package
-  # push!(plt.seriesargs, d)
   # TODO: this should be moved to the display method?
   x, y, z = map(Float32, series.d[:x]), map(Float32, series.d[:y]), map(Float32, series.d[:z].surf)
   GLVisualize.view(GLVisualize.visualize((x*ones(y)', ones(x)*y', z), :surface), plt.o.window)
   # plt
 end
 
-function _add_annotations{X,Y,V}(plt::Plot{GLVisualizeBackend}, anns::AVec{@compat(Tuple{X,Y,V})})
-  for ann in anns
-    # TODO: add the annotation to the plot
-  end
+
+# When series data is added/changed, this callback can do dynamic updates to the backend object.
+# note: if the backend rebuilds the plot from scratch on display, then you might not do anything here.
+function _series_updated(plt::Plot{GLVisualizeBackend}, series::Series)
+    # TODO
 end
 
 # ----------------------------------------------------------------
 
-function _before_update_plot(plt::Plot{GLVisualizeBackend})
+
+# Override this to update plot items (title, xlabel, etc), and add annotations (d[:annotations])
+function _update_plot_object(plt::Plot{GLVisualizeBackend})
+    # TODO
 end
 
-# TODO: override this to update plot items (title, xlabel, etc) after creation
-function _update_plot(plt::Plot{GLVisualizeBackend}, d::KW)
-end
-
-function _update_plot_pos_size(plt::AbstractPlot{GLVisualizeBackend}, d::KW)
-end
 
 # ----------------------------------------------------------------
 
-# accessors for x/y data
-
-function getxy(plt::Plot{GLVisualizeBackend}, i::Int)
-  # TODO:
-  # series = plt.o.lines[i]
-  # series.x, series.y
-  nothing, nothing
-end
-
-function setxy!{X,Y}(plt::Plot{GLVisualizeBackend}, xy::Tuple{X,Y}, i::Integer)
-  # TODO:
-  # series = plt.o.lines[i]
-  # series.x, series.y = xy
-  plt
-end
-
-# ----------------------------------------------------------------
-
-# function _create_subplot(subplt::Subplot{GLVisualizeBackend})
-#   # TODO: build the underlying Subplot object.  this is where you might layout the panes within a GUI window, for example
-# end
-
-function _expand_limits(lims, plt::Plot{GLVisualizeBackend}, isx::Bool)
-  # TODO: call expand limits for each plot data
-end
-
-function _remove_axis(plt::Plot{GLVisualizeBackend}, isx::Bool)
-  # TODO: if plot is inner subplot, might need to remove ticks or axis labels
-end
-
-# ----------------------------------------------------------------
-
-function Base.writemime(io::IO, ::MIME"image/png", plt::AbstractPlot{GLVisualizeBackend})
+function _writemime(io::IO, ::MIME"image/png", plt::AbstractPlot{GLVisualizeBackend})
   # TODO: write a png to io
 end
 
-function Base.display(::PlotsDisplay, plt::Plot{GLVisualizeBackend})
+function _display(plt::Plot{GLVisualizeBackend})
   # TODO: display/show the plot
 
   # NOTE: I think maybe this should be empty?  We can start with the assumption that creating
   #       and adding to a plot will automatically open a window and draw to it, then the display
   #       wouldn't actually need to do anything
 end
-
-# function Base.display(::PlotsDisplay, plt::Subplot{GLVisualizeBackend})
-#   # TODO: display/show the subplot
-# end
diff --git a/src/backends/immerse.jl b/src/backends/immerse.jl
index 42576158..267af35e 100644
--- a/src/backends/immerse.jl
+++ b/src/backends/immerse.jl
@@ -53,7 +53,7 @@ function _series_added(plt::Plot{ImmerseBackend}, series::Series)
 end
 
 
-function _update_plot(plt::Plot{ImmerseBackend}, d::KW)
+function _update_plot_object(plt::Plot{ImmerseBackend}, d::KW)
   updateGadflyGuides(plt, d)
   updateGadflyPlotTheme(plt, d)
 end
diff --git a/src/backends/pgfplots.jl b/src/backends/pgfplots.jl
index fb351306..c29e3e35 100644
--- a/src/backends/pgfplots.jl
+++ b/src/backends/pgfplots.jl
@@ -259,7 +259,7 @@ end
 # end
 
 # TODO: override this to update plot items (title, xlabel, etc) after creation
-function _update_plot(plt::Plot{PGFPlotsBackend}, d::KW)
+function _update_plot_object(plt::Plot{PGFPlotsBackend}, d::KW)
 end
 
 # function _update_plot_pos_size(plt::AbstractPlot{PGFPlotsBackend}, d::KW)
diff --git a/src/backends/plotly.jl b/src/backends/plotly.jl
index 151468f4..253b16f7 100644
--- a/src/backends/plotly.jl
+++ b/src/backends/plotly.jl
@@ -112,10 +112,10 @@ end
 # end
 #
 # # TODO: override this to update plot items (title, xlabel, etc) after creation
-# function _update_plot(plt::Plot{PlotlyBackend}, d::KW)
+# function _update_plot_object(plt::Plot{PlotlyBackend}, d::KW)
 # end
 
-# function _update_plot_pos_size(plt::AbstractPlot{PlotlyBackend}, d::KW)
+# function _update_plot_pos_size(plt::Plot{PlotlyBackend}, d::KW)
 # end
 
 # ----------------------------------------------------------------
@@ -573,7 +573,7 @@ end
 
 # ----------------------------------------------------------------
 
-function html_head(plt::AbstractPlot{PlotlyBackend})
+function html_head(plt::Plot{PlotlyBackend})
     "<script src=\"$(Pkg.dir("Plots","deps","plotly-latest.min.js"))\"></script>"
 end
 
@@ -603,24 +603,25 @@ end
 
 # ----------------------------------------------------------------
 
-# compute layout bboxes
-function plotly_finalize(plt::Plot)
-    w, h = plt.attr[:size]
-    plt.layout.bbox = BoundingBox(0mm, 0mm, w*px, h*px)
-    update_child_bboxes!(plt.layout)
-end
+# # compute layout bboxes
+# function plotly_finalize(plt::Plot)
+#     w, h = plt.attr[:size]
+#     plt.layout.bbox = BoundingBox(0mm, 0mm, w*px, h*px)
+#     update_child_bboxes!(plt.layout)
+# end
 
-function Base.writemime(io::IO, ::MIME"image/png", plt::AbstractPlot{PlotlyBackend})
-    plotly_finalize(plt)
+function _writemime(io::IO, ::MIME"image/png", plt::Plot{PlotlyBackend})
+    # plotly_finalize(plt)
     writemime_png_from_html(io, plt)
 end
 
-function Base.writemime(io::IO, ::MIME"text/html", plt::AbstractPlot{PlotlyBackend})
-    plotly_finalize(plt)
+function _writemime(io::IO, ::MIME"text/html", plt::Plot{PlotlyBackend})
+    # plotly_finalize(plt)
     write(io, html_head(plt) * html_body(plt))
 end
 
-function Base.display(::PlotsDisplay, plt::AbstractPlot{PlotlyBackend})
-    plotly_finalize(plt)
+# function Base.display(::PlotsDisplay, plt::Plot{PlotlyBackend})
+function _display(plt::Plot{PlotlyBackend})
+    # plotly_finalize(plt)
     standalone_html_window(plt)
 end
diff --git a/src/backends/plotlyjs.jl b/src/backends/plotlyjs.jl
index 8a729df9..33d4f549 100644
--- a/src/backends/plotlyjs.jl
+++ b/src/backends/plotlyjs.jl
@@ -114,48 +114,35 @@ end
 
 
 function _series_added(plt::Plot{PlotlyJSBackend}, series::Series)
-    # d = series.d
     syncplot = plt.o
-
-    # add to the data array
     pdict = plotly_series(plt, series)
     typ = pop!(pdict, :type)
     gt = PlotlyJS.GenericTrace(typ; pdict...)
     PlotlyJS.addtraces!(syncplot, gt)
-
-    # push!(plt.seriesargs, d)
-    # plt
 end
 
+function _series_updated(plt::Plot{PlotlyJSBackend}, series::Series)
+    xsym, ysym = (ispolar(series) ? (:t,:r) : (:x,:y))
+    PlotlyJS.restyle!(
+        plt.o,
+        findfirst(plt.series_list, series),
+        KW(xsym => (series.d[:x],), ysym => (series.d[:y],))
+    )
+end
 
-# ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
-
-# function _add_annotations{X,Y,V}(plt::Plot{PlotlyJSBackend}, anns::AVec{@compat(Tuple{X,Y,V})})
-#     # set or add to the annotation_list
-#     if !haskey(plt.attr, :annotation_list)
-#         plt.attr[:annotation_list] = Any[]
-#     end
-#     append!(plt.attr[:annotation_list], anns)
-# end
 
 # ----------------------------------------------------------------
 
-# function _before_update_plot(plt::Plot{PlotlyJSBackend})
-# end
-
 # TODO: override this to update plot items (title, xlabel, etc) after creation
-function _update_plot(plt::Plot{PlotlyJSBackend}, d::KW)
+function _update_plot_object(plt::Plot{PlotlyJSBackend})
     pdict = plotly_layout(plt)
     syncplot = plt.o
     w,h = plt.attr[:size]
+    DD(pdict)
     PlotlyJS.relayout!(syncplot, pdict, width = w, height = h)
 end
 
 
-# function _update_plot_pos_size(plt::AbstractPlot{PlotlyJSBackend}, d::KW)
-# end
-
 # ----------------------------------------------------------------
 
 # accessors for x/y data
@@ -165,15 +152,6 @@ end
 #   d[:x], d[:y]
 # end
 
-function _series_updated(plt::Plot{PlotlyJSBackend}, series::Series)
-    xsym, ysym = (ispolar(series) ? (:t,:r) : (:x,:y))
-    PlotlyJS.restyle!(
-        plt.o,
-        findfirst(plt.series_list, series),
-        KW(xsym => series.d[:x], ysym => series.d[:y])
-    )
-end
-
 # function setxy!{X,Y}(plt::Plot{PlotlyJSBackend}, xy::Tuple{X,Y}, i::Integer)
 #   d = plt.seriesargs[i]
 #   ispolar = get(plt.attr, :polar, false)
@@ -185,47 +163,25 @@ end
 #   plt
 # end
 
-# ----------------------------------------------------------------
-
-# function _create_subplot(subplt::Subplot{PlotlyJSBackend}, isbefore::Bool)
-#   # TODO: build the underlying Subplot object.  this is where you might layout the panes within a GUI window, for example
-#   true
-# end
-
-# function _expand_limits(lims, plt::Plot{PlotlyJSBackend}, isx::Bool)
-#   # TODO: call expand limits for each plot data
-# end
-#
-# function _remove_axis(plt::Plot{PlotlyJSBackend}, isx::Bool)
-#   # TODO: if plot is inner subplot, might need to remove ticks or axis labels
-# end
 
 # ----------------------------------------------------------------
 
-# function Base.writemime(io::IO, m::MIME"text/html", plt::AbstractPlot{PlotlyJSBackend})
-#     Base.writemime(io, m, plt.o)
-# end
-
-# function Base.writemime(io::IO, ::MIME"image/png", plt::AbstractPlot{PlotlyJSBackend})
-#     println("here!")
-#     writemime_png_from_html(io, plt)
-# end
-
-
 function _update_min_padding!(sp::Subplot{PlotlyBackend})
     sp.minpad = plotly_minpad(sp)
 end
 
-function plotlyjs_finalize(plt::Plot)
-    plotly_finalize(plt)
-    PlotlyJS.relayout!(plt.o, plotly_layout(plt))
+# function plotlyjs_finalize(plt::Plot)
+#     plotly_finalize(plt)
+#     PlotlyJS.relayout!(plt.o, plotly_layout(plt))
+# end
+
+function _writemime(io::IO, ::MIME"image/png", plt::Plot{PlotlyJSBackend})
+    tmpfn = tempname() * "png"
+    PlotlyJS.savefig(plt.o, tmpfn)
+    write(io, read(open(tmpfn)))
 end
 
-function Base.display(::PlotsDisplay, plt::Plot{PlotlyJSBackend})
-    plotlyjs_finalize(plt)
+function _display(plt::Plot{PlotlyJSBackend})
+    # plotlyjs_finalize(plt)
     display(plt.o)
 end
-
-# function Base.display(::PlotsDisplay, plt::Subplot{PlotlyJSBackend})
-#     error()
-# end
diff --git a/src/backends/pyplot.jl b/src/backends/pyplot.jl
index 65f6a1b8..b3337c11 100644
--- a/src/backends/pyplot.jl
+++ b/src/backends/pyplot.jl
@@ -300,12 +300,12 @@ drawax(ax) = ax[:draw](renderer(ax[:get_figure]()))
 # get a vector [left, right, bottom, top] in PyPlot coords (origin is bottom-left!)
 get_extents(obj) = obj[:get_window_extent]()[:get_points]()
 
-# bounding box of the figure
-function py_bbox_fig(fig)
-    fl, fr, fb, ft = get_extents(fig)
-    BoundingBox(0px, 0px, (fr-fl)*px, (ft-fb)*px)
-end
-py_bbox_fig(plt::Plot) = py_bbox_fig(plt.o)
+# # bounding box of the figure
+# function py_bbox_fig(fig)
+#     fl, fr, fb, ft = get_extents(fig)
+#     BoundingBox(0px, 0px, (fr-fl)*px, (ft-fb)*px)
+# end
+# py_bbox_fig(plt::Plot) = py_bbox_fig(plt.o)
 
 # compute a bounding box (with origin top-left), however pyplot gives coords with origin bottom-left
 function py_bbox(obj)
@@ -399,58 +399,27 @@ function _initialize_subplot(plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend}, sp::Subplot{PyPlotBackend
     )
     sp.o = ax
 end
-
-# Set the (left, top, right, bottom) minimum padding around the plot area
-# to fit ticks, tick labels, guides, colorbars, etc.
-function _update_min_padding!(sp::Subplot{PyPlotBackend})
-    ax = sp.o
-    ax == nothing && return sp.minpad
-    plotbb = py_bbox(ax)
-
-    # TODO: this should initialize to the margin from sp.attr
-    # figure out how much the axis components and title "stick out" from the plot area
-    # leftpad = toppad = rightpad = bottompad = 1mm
-    leftpad   = sp.attr[:left_margin]
-    toppad    = sp.attr[:top_margin]
-    rightpad  = sp.attr[:right_margin]
-    bottompad = sp.attr[:bottom_margin]
-    for bb in (py_bbox_axis(ax, "x"), py_bbox_axis(ax, "y"), py_bbox_title(ax))
-        if ispositive(width(bb)) && ispositive(height(bb))
-            leftpad   = max(leftpad,   left(plotbb) - left(bb))
-            toppad    = max(toppad,    top(plotbb)  - top(bb))
-            rightpad  = max(rightpad,  right(bb)    - right(plotbb))
-            bottompad = max(bottompad, bottom(bb)   - bottom(plotbb))
-        end
-    end
-
-    # optionally add the width of colorbar labels and colorbar to rightpad
-    if haskey(sp.attr, :cbar_ax)
-        bb = py_bbox(sp.attr[:cbar_handle][:ax][:get_yticklabels]())
-        sp.attr[:cbar_width] = _cbar_width + width(bb) + 1mm
-        rightpad = rightpad + sp.attr[:cbar_width]
-    end
-
-    sp.minpad = (leftpad, toppad, rightpad, bottompad)
-end
-
-# Use the bounding boxes (and methods left/top/right/bottom/width/height) `sp.bbox` and `sp.plotarea` to
-# position the subplot in the backend.
-function _update_position!(sp::Subplot{PyPlotBackend})
-    ax = sp.o
-    ax == nothing && return
-    figw, figh = size(py_bbox_fig(sp.plt))
-    pcts = bbox_to_pcts(sp.plotarea, figw, figh)
-    ax[:set_position](pcts)
-
-    # set the cbar position if there is one
-    if haskey(sp.attr, :cbar_ax)
-        cbw = sp.attr[:cbar_width]
-        # this is the bounding box of just the colors of the colorbar (not labels)
-        cb_bbox = BoundingBox(right(sp.bbox)-cbw+1mm, top(sp.bbox)+2mm, _cbar_width-1mm, height(sp.bbox)-4mm)
-        pcts = bbox_to_pcts(cb_bbox, figw, figh)
-        sp.attr[:cbar_ax][:set_position](pcts)
-    end
-end
+#
+# # Use the bounding boxes (and methods left/top/right/bottom/width/height) `sp.bbox` and `sp.plotarea` to
+# # position the subplot in the backend.
+# function _update_position!(sp::Subplot{PyPlotBackend})
+#     ax = sp.o
+#     ax == nothing && return
+#     # figw, figh = size(py_bbox_fig(sp.plt))
+#     figw, figh = sp.plt.attr[:size]
+#     figw, figh = figw*px, figh*px
+#     pcts = bbox_to_pcts(sp.plotarea, figw, figh)
+#     ax[:set_position](pcts)
+#
+#     # set the cbar position if there is one
+#     if haskey(sp.attr, :cbar_ax)
+#         cbw = sp.attr[:cbar_width]
+#         # this is the bounding box of just the colors of the colorbar (not labels)
+#         cb_bbox = BoundingBox(right(sp.bbox)-cbw+1mm, top(sp.bbox)+2mm, _cbar_width-1mm, height(sp.bbox)-4mm)
+#         pcts = bbox_to_pcts(cb_bbox, figw, figh)
+#         sp.attr[:cbar_ax][:set_position](pcts)
+#     end
+# end
 
 # ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
@@ -1003,7 +972,7 @@ end
 # --------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
 
-function _update_plot(plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend}, d::KW)
+function _before_layout_calcs(plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend})
     for sp in plt.subplots
         attr = sp.attr
         ax = getAxis(sp)
@@ -1054,6 +1023,7 @@ function _update_plot(plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend}, d::KW)
                 ax[axissym][:grid](true, color = fgcolor)
                 ax[:set_axisbelow](true)
             end
+            updateAxisColors(ax, axis)
         end
 
         # aspect ratio
@@ -1061,7 +1031,44 @@ function _update_plot(plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend}, d::KW)
         if aratio != :none
             ax[:set_aspect](isa(aratio, Symbol) ? string(aratio) : aratio, anchor = "C")
         end
+
+        addPyPlotLegend(plt, sp, ax)
     end
+    drawfig(plt.o)
+end
+
+
+# Set the (left, top, right, bottom) minimum padding around the plot area
+# to fit ticks, tick labels, guides, colorbars, etc.
+function _update_min_padding!(sp::Subplot{PyPlotBackend})
+    ax = sp.o
+    ax == nothing && return sp.minpad
+    plotbb = py_bbox(ax)
+
+    # TODO: this should initialize to the margin from sp.attr
+    # figure out how much the axis components and title "stick out" from the plot area
+    # leftpad = toppad = rightpad = bottompad = 1mm
+    leftpad   = sp.attr[:left_margin]
+    toppad    = sp.attr[:top_margin]
+    rightpad  = sp.attr[:right_margin]
+    bottompad = sp.attr[:bottom_margin]
+    for bb in (py_bbox_axis(ax, "x"), py_bbox_axis(ax, "y"), py_bbox_title(ax))
+        if ispositive(width(bb)) && ispositive(height(bb))
+            leftpad   = max(leftpad,   left(plotbb) - left(bb))
+            toppad    = max(toppad,    top(plotbb)  - top(bb))
+            rightpad  = max(rightpad,  right(bb)    - right(plotbb))
+            bottompad = max(bottompad, bottom(bb)   - bottom(plotbb))
+        end
+    end
+
+    # optionally add the width of colorbar labels and colorbar to rightpad
+    if haskey(sp.attr, :cbar_ax)
+        bb = py_bbox(sp.attr[:cbar_handle][:ax][:get_yticklabels]())
+        sp.attr[:cbar_width] = _cbar_width + width(bb) + 1mm
+        rightpad = rightpad + sp.attr[:cbar_width]
+    end
+
+    sp.minpad = (leftpad, toppad, rightpad, bottompad)
 end
 
 
@@ -1160,33 +1167,68 @@ end
 
 # -----------------------------------------------------------------
 
-# add legend, update colors and positions, then draw
-function finalizePlot(plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend})
+# # add legend, update colors and positions, then draw
+# function finalizePlot(plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend})
+#     # for sp in plt.subplots
+#     #     # ax = getLeftAxis(plt)
+#     #     ax = getAxis(sp)
+#     #     ax == nothing && continue
+#     #     addPyPlotLegend(plt, sp, ax)
+#     #     for asym in (:xaxis, :yaxis, :zaxis)
+#     #         updateAxisColors(ax, sp.attr[asym])
+#     #     end
+#     # end
+#     drawfig(plt.o)
+#     # plt.layout.bbox = py_bbox_fig(plt)
+#
+#     # TODO: these should be called outside of pyplot... how?
+#     update_child_bboxes!(plt.layout)
+#     _update_position!(plt.layout)
+#
+#     PyPlot.draw()
+# end
+
+# function _before_layout_calcs(plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend})
+#     drawfig(plt.o)
+# end
+
+# Use the bounding boxes (and methods left/top/right/bottom/width/height) `sp.bbox` and `sp.plotarea` to
+# position the subplot in the backend.
+function _update_plot_object(plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend})
     for sp in plt.subplots
-        # ax = getLeftAxis(plt)
-        ax = getAxis(sp)
-        ax == nothing && continue
-        addPyPlotLegend(plt, sp, ax)
-        for asym in (:xaxis, :yaxis, :zaxis)
-            updateAxisColors(ax, sp.attr[asym])
+        ax = sp.o
+        ax == nothing && return
+        # figw, figh = size(py_bbox_fig(sp.plt))
+        figw, figh = sp.plt.attr[:size]
+        figw, figh = figw*px, figh*px
+        pcts = bbox_to_pcts(sp.plotarea, figw, figh)
+        ax[:set_position](pcts)
+
+        # set the cbar position if there is one
+        if haskey(sp.attr, :cbar_ax)
+            cbw = sp.attr[:cbar_width]
+            # this is the bounding box of just the colors of the colorbar (not labels)
+            cb_bbox = BoundingBox(right(sp.bbox)-cbw+1mm, top(sp.bbox)+2mm, _cbar_width-1mm, height(sp.bbox)-4mm)
+            pcts = bbox_to_pcts(cb_bbox, figw, figh)
+            sp.attr[:cbar_ax][:set_position](pcts)
         end
     end
-    drawfig(plt.o)
-    plt.layout.bbox = py_bbox_fig(plt)
-
-    # TODO: these should be called outside of pyplot... how?
-    update_child_bboxes!(plt.layout)
-    _update_position!(plt.layout)
-
     PyPlot.draw()
 end
 
-
 # -----------------------------------------------------------------
 # display/output
 
-function Base.display(::PlotsDisplay, plt::AbstractPlot{PyPlotBackend})
-    finalizePlot(plt)
+# function Base.display(::PlotsDisplay, plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend})
+#     finalizePlot(plt)
+#     if isa(Base.Multimedia.displays[end], Base.REPL.REPLDisplay)
+#         display(getfig(plt.o))
+#     end
+#     getfig(plt.o)[:show]()
+# end
+
+function _display(plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend})
+    # finalizePlot(plt)
     if isa(Base.Multimedia.displays[end], Base.REPL.REPLDisplay)
         display(getfig(plt.o))
     end
@@ -1194,6 +1236,7 @@ function Base.display(::PlotsDisplay, plt::AbstractPlot{PyPlotBackend})
 end
 
 
+
 const _pyplot_mimeformats = Dict(
     "application/eps"         => "eps",
     "image/eps"               => "eps",
@@ -1205,8 +1248,9 @@ const _pyplot_mimeformats = Dict(
 
 
 for (mime, fmt) in _pyplot_mimeformats
-    @eval function Base.writemime(io::IO, ::MIME{symbol($mime)}, plt::AbstractPlot{PyPlotBackend})
-        finalizePlot(plt)
+    # @eval function Base.writemime(io::IO, ::MIME{symbol($mime)}, plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend})
+    @eval function _writemime(io::IO, ::MIME{symbol($mime)}, plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend})
+        # finalizePlot(plt)
         fig = getfig(plt.o)
         fig.o["canvas"][:print_figure](
             io,
diff --git a/src/backends/qwt.jl b/src/backends/qwt.jl
index e7651341..588dfe3e 100644
--- a/src/backends/qwt.jl
+++ b/src/backends/qwt.jl
@@ -190,7 +190,7 @@ function updateLimsAndTicks(plt::Plot{QwtBackend}, d::KW, isx::Bool)
 end
 
 
-function _update_plot(plt::Plot{QwtBackend}, d::KW)
+function _update_plot_object(plt::Plot{QwtBackend}, d::KW)
   haskey(d, :title) && Qwt.title(plt.o, d[:title])
   haskey(d, :xguide) && Qwt.xlabel(plt.o, d[:xguide])
   haskey(d, :yguide) && Qwt.ylabel(plt.o, d[:yguide])
diff --git a/src/backends/template.jl b/src/backends/template.jl
index 10580287..6d989518 100644
--- a/src/backends/template.jl
+++ b/src/backends/template.jl
@@ -3,7 +3,7 @@
 
 # [ADD BACKEND WEBSITE]
 
-function _initialize_backend(::[PkgName]AbstractBackend; kw...)
+function _initialize_backend(::[PkgName]Backend; kw...)
     @eval begin
         import [PkgName]
         export [PkgName]
@@ -19,42 +19,43 @@ function _create_backend_figure(plt::Plot{[PkgName]Backend})
     nothing
 end
 
+# this is called early in the pipeline, use it to make the plot current or something
+function _prepare_plot_object(plt::Plot{[PkgName]})
+end
+
 # Set up the subplot within the backend object.
 function _initialize_subplot(plt::Plot{PyPlotBackend}, sp::Subplot{PyPlotBackend})
 end
 
+# ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+
+# Add one series to the underlying backend object.
+function _series_added(plt::Plot{[PkgName]Backend}, series::Series)
+end
+
+# When series data is added/changed, this callback can do dynamic updates to the backend object.
+# note: if the backend rebuilds the plot from scratch on display, then you might not do anything here.
+function _series_updated(plt::Plot{[PkgName]Backend}, series::Series)
+end
+
+# ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+
+# called just before updating layout bounding boxes... in case you need to prep
+# for the calcs
+function _before_layout_calcs(plt::Plot)
+end
+
 # Set the (left, top, right, bottom) minimum padding around the plot area
 # to fit ticks, tick labels, guides, colorbars, etc.
 function _update_min_padding!(sp::Subplot{[PkgName]Backend})
     sp.minpad = (20mm, 5mm, 2mm, 10mm)
 end
 
-# Use the bounding boxes (and methods left/top/right/bottom/width/height) `sp.bbox` and `sp.plotarea` to
-# position the subplot in the backend.
-function _update_position!(sp::Subplot{[PkgName]Backend})
-end
 
 # ----------------------------------------------------------------
 
-# This is called before series processing... use it if you need to make the backend object current or something.
-function _before_update(plt::Plot{[PkgName]AbstractBackend})
-end
-
-
-# Add one series to the underlying backend object.
-function _series_added(plt::Plot{[PkgName]Backend}, series::Series)
-end
-
-
 # Override this to update plot items (title, xlabel, etc), and add annotations (d[:annotations])
-function _update_plot(plt::Plot{[PkgName]AbstractBackend}, d::KW)
-end
-
-# ----------------------------------------------------------------
-
-# When series data is added/changed, this callback can do dynamic updates to the backend object.
-# note: if the backend rebuilds the plot from scratch on display, then you might not do anything here.
-function _series_updated(plt::Plot{[PkgName]AbstractBackend}, series::Series)
+function _update_plot_object(plt::Plot{[PkgName]Backend})
 end
 
 # ----------------------------------------------------------------
@@ -66,9 +67,9 @@ end
     # "image/png"               => "png",
     # "application/postscript"  => "ps",
     # "image/svg+xml"           => "svg"
-function Base.writemime(io::IO, ::MIME"image/png", plt::AbstractPlot{[PkgName]AbstractBackend})
+function _writemime(io::IO, ::MIME"image/png", plt::Plot{[PkgName]Backend})
 end
 
 # Display/show the plot (open a GUI window, or browser page, for example).
-function Base.display(::PlotsDisplay, plt::Plot{[PkgName]AbstractBackend})
+function _display(plt::Plot{[PkgName]Backend})
 end
diff --git a/src/backends/unicodeplots.jl b/src/backends/unicodeplots.jl
index fb8ae0a6..a09b255a 100644
--- a/src/backends/unicodeplots.jl
+++ b/src/backends/unicodeplots.jl
@@ -208,7 +208,7 @@ function _series_added(plt::Plot{UnicodePlotsBackend}, series::Series)
 end
 
 
-function _update_plot(plt::Plot{UnicodePlotsBackend}, d::KW)
+function _update_plot_object(plt::Plot{UnicodePlotsBackend}, d::KW)
   for k in (:title, :xguide, :yguide, :xlims, :ylims)
     if haskey(d, k)
       plt.attr[k] = d[k]
diff --git a/src/backends/winston.jl b/src/backends/winston.jl
index 93f8cf2c..a6ed1504 100644
--- a/src/backends/winston.jl
+++ b/src/backends/winston.jl
@@ -227,7 +227,7 @@ end
     :yscale => :ylog,
   )
 
-function _update_plot(plt::Plot{WinstonBackend}, d::KW)
+function _update_plot_object(plt::Plot{WinstonBackend}, d::KW)
   window, canvas, wplt = getWinstonItems(plt)
   for k in (:xguide, :yguide, :title, :xlims, :ylims)
     if haskey(d, k)
diff --git a/src/components.jl b/src/components.jl
index 981a4955..50eae130 100644
--- a/src/components.jl
+++ b/src/components.jl
@@ -256,6 +256,13 @@ text(t::PlotText) = t
 function text(str, args...)
   PlotText(string(str), font(args...))
 end
+
+
+annotations(::Void) = []
+annotations(anns::AVec) = anns
+annotations(anns) = Any[anns]
+
+
 # -----------------------------------------------------------------------
 
 # -----------------------------------------------------------------------
diff --git a/src/output.jl b/src/output.jl
index ce16f582..6e0d0654 100644
--- a/src/output.jl
+++ b/src/output.jl
@@ -103,15 +103,37 @@ savefig(fn::@compat(AbstractString)) = savefig(current(), fn)
 
 gui(plt::AbstractPlot = current()) = display(PlotsDisplay(), plt)
 
+function Base.display(::PlotsDisplay, plt::Plot)
+    prepare_output(plt)
+    _display(plt)
+end
 
 # override the REPL display to open a gui window
 Base.display(::Base.REPL.REPLDisplay, ::MIME"text/plain", plt::AbstractPlot) = gui(plt)
 
+# ---------------------------------------------------------
+
+const _mimeformats = Dict(
+    "application/eps"         => "eps",
+    "image/eps"               => "eps",
+    "application/pdf"         => "pdf",
+    "image/png"               => "png",
+    "application/postscript"  => "ps",
+    "image/svg+xml"           => "svg"
+)
+
 # a backup for html... passes to svg
 function Base.writemime(io::IO, ::MIME"text/html", plt::AbstractPlot)
     writemime(io, MIME("image/svg+xml"), plt)
 end
 
+for mime in keys(_mimeformats)
+    @eval function writemime(io::IO, m::MIME{Symbol($mime)}, plt::Plot)
+        prepare_output(plt)
+        _writemime(io, m, plt)
+    end
+end
+
 # ---------------------------------------------------------
 # IJulia
 # ---------------------------------------------------------
diff --git a/src/plot.jl b/src/plot.jl
index 1b17e218..bb2bca6f 100644
--- a/src/plot.jl
+++ b/src/plot.jl
@@ -163,7 +163,7 @@ end
 # note: at entry, we only have those preprocessed args which were passed in... no default values yet
 function _plot!(plt::Plot, d::KW, args...)
     # just in case the backend needs to set up the plot (make it current or something)
-    _before_update(plt)
+    _prepare_plot_object(plt)
 
     # first apply any args for the subplots
     for (idx,sp) in enumerate(plt.subplots)
@@ -289,8 +289,14 @@ function _plot!(plt::Plot, d::KW, args...)
         _apply_series_recipe(plt, kw)
     end
 
-    # TODO just need to pass plt... and we should do all non-series updates here
-    _update_plot(plt, plt.attr)
+    # # everything is processed, time to compute the layout bounding boxes
+    # _before_layout_calcs(plt)
+    # w, h = plt.attr[:size]
+    # plt.layout.bbox = BoundingBox(0mm, 0mm, w*px, h*px)
+    # update_child_bboxes!(plt.layout)
+    #
+    # # TODO just need to pass plt... and we should do all non-series updates here
+    # _update_plot_object(plt)
 
     current(plt)
 
@@ -311,6 +317,17 @@ function _replace_linewidth(d::KW)
     end
 end
 
+# we're getting ready to display/output.  prep for layout calcs, then update
+# the plot object after
+function prepare_output(plt::Plot)
+    _before_layout_calcs(plt)
+
+    w, h = plt.attr[:size]
+    plt.layout.bbox = BoundingBox(0mm, 0mm, w*px, h*px)
+    update_child_bboxes!(plt.layout)
+
+    _update_plot_object(plt)
+end
 
 # --------------------------------------------------------------------
 
@@ -370,9 +387,6 @@ end
 
 # --------------------------------------------------------------------
 
-annotations(::Void) = []
-annotations(anns::AVec) = anns
-annotations(anns) = Any[anns]
 
 
 # --------------------------------------------------------------------